Camshaft question

[Death-the-Kid]

I really didn't plan on building the motor till after turbo. It's just way too much money for me. Iv read and people say up to 8 psi is safe with a good tune so I planned on trying that route. Again I'm new and I dont need people hating, I need help.

those people are dumb. psi is an arbitrary number. 8 psi on one turbo is different than 8 psi on another. and why would you build your motor after a major FI modification? not hating but you need to talk to a tangible person and not internet guru's where everybody has a virtual race car that run's 10's on street tires. what exactly is your power goal and what is your budget. also where are you located.

 

[thenoxus1]

To the guy saying don't increase CR without sleeving, you couldn't be more wrong. If you were running a 13.1:1 CR I would forge internals. I'm running 11.53:1 in my GSR on stock sleeves and using B16 Pistons. PSI is dependent on the turbo size. Imagine a large hose and a soup can. If you have a fire hose, you can slide that one can through easy enough, if you have a garden hose, it's a lot tighter of a fit with that same can.

 

[Samurai_Blue]

Actually you can tell if he at least upgraded the valve springs for the exhaust side assuming he dd both cams. He will have added dual valve springs to it if he did. I think if u take off the cam caps you can see the part you need to id the cams. Someone correct me.

To sum it up and very generalized.. all motor high compression, turbo you build the internals and leave the compression.

i was yelled at that for saying you cant turbo high compression. -___- oh well.

Anyways yes the cam caps on the distributor side will allow you to see the cam caps. you do need to take off the girlde as well. the dizzy side of the cam will have markings, check the intake cam.

 

[thenoxus1]

You can boost high compression engines, you just need to have a great tuner. My tuner, Jeff Evans of Evans Tuning has an 8 second B series Integra. It's a record holder in its class. His car is making 900 something whp on 12:1 compression ratio.

For more info:

http://www.evans-tuning.com/racing/

 

[Death-the-Kid]

You can boost high compression engines, you just need to have a great tuner. My tuner, Jeff Evans of Evans Tuning has an 8 second B series Integra. It's a record holder in its class. His car is making 900 something whp on 12:1 compression ratio.

For more info:

http://www.evans-tuning.com/racing/

because it's a race car :lol:

UMM NO
that is not possible to daily drive and it's also running race gas. it's also sleeved and built. anything is possible with money but that doesn't make it practical, feasible or realistic. please give the whole story when giving recommendations to noobs.

to the op no you do not want to raise your compression past 10:1. unless you sleeve your block and are trying to make 400whp+ reliably i wouldn't build a motor going past 9.5:1 CR. that motor if it were daily driven would be at that power would need to be rebuilt routinely. congrats jeff evans is tuning your car but unless you're making those kind of numbers on your daily driven car, your statement us null and void.

here are the specs on that "stage 3" block you listed off of the site. see where it says sleeves?

To the guy saying don't increase CR without sleeving, you couldn't be more wrong. If you were running a 13.1:1 CR I would forge internals. I'm running 11.53:1 in my GSR on stock sleeves and using B16 Pistons. PSI is dependent on the turbo size. Imagine a large hose and a soup can. If you have a fire hose, you can slide that one can through easy enough, if you have a garden hose, it's a lot tighter of a fit with that same can.

I'm wrong? .
This is why i hate forum tuners
Have you ever even owned or worked on a highly modified turbo car before?

-psi is not dependent on turbo size. psi is psi. the cfm of a specific turbo at a given psi is dependent on turbo wheel and housing size. larger turbo running 10 psi is still 10 pounds per square inch, the same as a smaller turbo running 10psi. the volume of air at that given psi is what changes.

-congrats on running 11.53:1 on a mildly built gsr... it has absolutely nothing to do with this debate of boosting on HIGH Compression on a street engine.what does your all motor 11.53:1 engine have to do with anything relevant to this issue of sleeve integrity when running high compression under turbo level cfm?

- you want to run 13:1 on a stock b-series with forged internals while boosting? go for it, let me know how long you last before you crack a sleeve or worse. unless you're running e85 or race gas coupled.

-even if you remain all motor, please explain how forged internals only will prevent the impending detonation from running such a high compression on pump gas level octane ratings.

still think i'm wrong? do me a favor and ask jeff evans. it is pointless to raise the compression on a b-series daily driven turbo engine that is already at 10:1. it's not a k-series nor does it have direct injection nor is it a race car

 

[thenoxus1]

Stop giving misinformation man. That particular car is not daily no. But plenty of us daily higher CR car. Ask 8urcivic, Ricky's car was like a 12 something CR getting dailyed. CR has nothing to do with the need for sleeves. Overall power level does. Most people say the stock sleeves are good to about 300 or so hp. This is a personal choice, if you were making 400-600, I'd be sleeving. I know plenty of guys on pump gas making 400whp and daily driving without sleeves. You seem to be confusing your power versus compression in your statements. I have a friend who's GSR swapped hatch is making 413 whp and he originally had an all motor setup with a CR around 10.7:1. That cars unsleeved and has been running for a couple years now no issues.

To the op, check out honda-tech's forced induction forum. A lot of higher CR builds on there running boost, many LSVTECs, all getting dailyed.

 

[Death-the-Kid]

Stop giving misinformation man. That particular car is not daily no. But plenty of us daily higher CR car. Ask 8urcivic, Ricky's car was like a 12 something CR getting dailyed. CR has nothing to do with the need for sleeves. Overall power level does. Most people say the stock sleeves are good to about 300 or so hp. This is a personal choice, if you were making 400-600, I'd be sleeving. I know plenty of guys on pump gas making 400whp and daily driving without sleeves. You seem to be confusing your power versus compression in your statements. I have a friend who's GSR swapped hatch is making 413 whp and he originally had an all motor setup with a CR around 10.7:1. That cars unsleeved and has been running for a couple years now no issues.

To the op, check out honda-tech's forced induction forum. A lot of higher CR builds on there running boost, many LSVTECs, all getting dailyed.

lol misinformation? CR has nothing to do with cracked sleeves? are you serious? Cr has everything to do with cracked sleeves. you do understand that the main reason sleeves crack isn't from hp but due to increased cylinder pressure right?

i said 10:1 or even 11:1 if fine is you already have it but it is not necessary to up your compression ratio past 10:1 if you already have a 10:1 engine.

it depends on the level of boost with which turbo you're running. again you are wrong and i can tell you don't build engines. you don't necessarily need sleeves at 400whp. but OP is wanting to raise his compression ratio when it's utterly pointless and has no benefit other than added cylinder pressure. it is a daily driver and he wants it reliable.

and a lot higher what? compression? 13:1 like you mentioned? right....and what fuel are they running? even your evans built race engine at 12:1 cr was sleeved

 

[thenoxus1]

Not going to disagree with you that it's pointless. I was simply stating you could do it. In my friend's case it was making the jump from all motor to boost. I do understand it's pressure, not magical WHP numbers that kill it. You made it sound like it was impossible, I was stating it's been done time and time again on a lot of setups because some builders get better response out of it is all.

Edited to not be a dick.

 

[Death-the-Kid]

Not going to disagree with you that it's pointless. I was simply stating you could do it. In my friend's case it was making the jump from all motor to boost. I do understand it's pressure, not magical WHP numbers that kill it. You made it sound like it was impossible, I was stating it's been done time and time again on a lot of setups because some builders get better response out of it is all.

Edited to not be a dick.

anything is possible and yes you can boost it but will it last? they made 700whp on a stock f20c....... until it blew up 5 days later.

the guy wants a recommendation on how to build a reliable boosted motor. and i never said you can't boost high compression. i said it's pointless to raise his 10:1 any higher unless he's going to sleeve to compensate if he plans on running high boost and making big power. i advocated in the beginning of the thread that 10:1 compression is a decent compression ratio because today's tuning technologies are well beyond what they used to be.

 

[Juhkeeb]

WOW, ok argue more on this thread but all i want to know is how i should go about boosting a daily driven GSR with a goal of like 300hp.

 

[Death-the-Kid]

WOW, ok argue more on this thread but all i want to know is how i should go about boosting a daily driven GSR with a goal of like 300hp.

300hp or 300whp?

either one can be had at stock compression

 

[Juhkeeb]

300whp. All i want is people to give me general ideas/steps/plans/parts/places to buy parts. I want to start this turbo project.

 

[NemesisCBR]

Because you have no idea what they were talking about, you have no appreciation for what they were argueing about. Its for your benefit.

Its the same discussion people have over running itr cams without upgrading the valve train. Sure it can be done and each person will get varying results but in general its not a good idea and its better and safer to upgrade to itr dual valve springs for it.

 

[thenoxus1]

Whatever his and my difference of opinion may be. We both clearly understand engines and forced induction.

You'll want to really do some research about turbo, trim sizes, and that sort of thing. Then come back and ask us specific questions about your parts selections etc. this is your car. You need to build it for you. We can't make it for you. Only offer guidance.

 

[Samurai_Blue]

Because you have no idea what they were talking about, you have no appreciation for what they were argueing about. Its for your benefit.

Its the same discussion people have over running itr cams without upgrading the valve train. Sure it can be done and each person will get varying results but in general its not a good idea and its better and safer to upgrade to itr dual valve springs for it.

same with crower 2 street cams. they can be used with stock springs (ITR) but they are at the absolute limit for them.